I know it's not really an issue on this NG but IF there was an interest in
attracting new users to Slack, this is a good time. I've been monitoring my
local LUG and those folks are going to leave RH because of their new
policies... but most seem to be interested in Gentoo with a few talking
Debian

I don't know the reasons (I have not posted to ask... as it is none of my
business) but I my guess is that Slack is not as well known as the
others... even though it is older. I get the feeling from meeting Deb folks
and Gentoo folks that they are more proactive in "pushing" their distro.
But don't go by that as it's just a feeling.... no hard facts to prove.

That said, when I was at the LinuxWorld conference last August there was a
booth of Gentoo people and they were "hard sell." They were really "pumped"
about Gentoo and excited to tell everyone. The Debian folks didn't have a
booth (it was a screw-up, as I remember) but there were a lot of them there
and they were fairly animated about Deb. I don't think there was a booth
for Slack, but I could be wrong. (I was covering the show for a magazine
and my assignment was Linux clustering so I spent most of the day with
hardware vendors.)

Again, IF the community was interested in getting new Slack "victims" :-)
some of you older/wiser/experienced guys/gals might wander into some of the
other Linux groups (or RH groups) and tell the Slackware story.

Oh, and how about Novell buying SuSE? (Or did they just by an interest? I
didn't get the whole story this AM.)


Al

Adams-Blake Co. <atakeoutcanton@adams-blaketakeout.com> wrote:
> I know it's not really an issue on this NG but IF there was an interest in
> attracting new users to Slack, this is a good time. I've been monitoring my

They will come to Slackware when they are ready for it.

> local LUG and those folks are going to leave RH because of their new
> policies... but most seem to be interested in Gentoo with a few talking
> Debian

If someone is leaving RH only because of it's policies, and not because
they don't like the distro, I seriously doubt they would like Slackware.

- Kurt

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On 2003-11-05, Adams-Blake Co. <atakeoutcanton@adams-blaketakeout.com> wrote:
>
> Again, IF the community was interested in getting new Slack "victims" :-)
> some of you older/wiser/experienced guys/gals might wander into some of the
> other Linux groups (or RH groups) and tell the Slackware story.

You know how the best vendors in a field don't need to advertise?

- --keith

- --
kkeller-usenet@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us
(try just my userid to email me)
AOLSFAQ=http://wombat.san-francisco.ca.us/cgi-bin/fom

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On Wed, 05 Nov 2003 03:26:47 GMT, Adams-Blake Co. <atakeoutcanton@adams-blaketakeout.com> wrote:
> That said, when I was at the LinuxWorld conference last August there was a
> booth of Gentoo people and they were "hard sell." They were really "pumped"
> about Gentoo and excited to tell everyone. The Debian folks didn't have a
> booth (it was a screw-up, as I remember) but there were a lot of them there
> and they were fairly animated about Deb. I don't think there was a booth
> for Slack, but I could be wrong. (I was covering the show for a magazine
> and my assignment was Linux clustering so I spent most of the day with
> hardware vendors.)

That's the difference between Slackware users and Gentoo/Debian users.

Gentoo users (ack! I'm a Gentoo user!) tend to say, "Look at Gentoo!
It's this new wonderful thing, it builds everything from source for you!
You get a fast and stable system, built JUST FOR YOUR COMPUTER! Look at
it! Come, see, Gentoo!"...

Debian users tend to say, "Look at Debian GNU/Linux! It's super-stable
and has no Dependency Hell! Everybody needs to use Debian, because it
is better, technically, politically, and ethically. Come, see Debian.
It is the best there is, it is the only real Linux."...

Slackware users tend to say, "Hmmm... I use Slackware. It works for me,
maybe since XXX doesn't work for you, you should try Slackware? 'eh...
give it a shot if you want, I like it, but it's not for everybody." ...

We're too realistic to be actively trying to get everybody and their
brother using Slackware. :-)

--
Rob | If not safe,
Email and Jabber: | one can never be free.
athlonrob at axpr dot net |
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On Tue, 04 Nov 2003 20:31:06 -0800, AthlonRob wrote:

> Gentoo users (ack! I'm a Gentoo user!) tend to say, "Look at Gentoo!
> It's this new wonderful thing, it builds everything from source for you!
> You get a fast and stable system, built JUST FOR YOUR COMPUTER! Look at
> it! Come, see, Gentoo!"...

I have Gentoo friends, and thats almost exactly what they say. Actually
its what gentoo is that makes me not want to use it.

> Debian users

I know very little debian users. Most of them, that I know, just run
servers (mainly httpd). Can't comment. Although the ethical part of it
answers some questions I had about debian.

> Slackware users tend to say, "Hmmm... I use Slackware. It works for me,
> maybe since XXX doesn't work for you, you should try Slackware? 'eh...
> give it a shot if you want, I like it, but it's not for everybody." ...

Exactly. Actually I would say that I use slack because thats what I
started with, and all other distros just get in my way. Try slack, if you
don't like it then don't use it. Simple as that.

> We're too realistic to be actively trying to get everybody and their
> brother using Slackware. :-)

Yes, just getting more people using it just lowers the community IQ. We
want quality, not quanity. Getting more RH users using slack will just
tarnish the name that slack users have been known for. (slack users tend
to know where to start with a prob than most other distro users,
regardless of the distro of box)

--
The best of us argue about ideas, most of us argue
about things, the worst of us argue about people.
--Unknown

On Wed, 05 Nov 2003 03:26:47 GMT, Adams-Blake Co.
<atakeoutcanton@adams-blaketakeout.com> wrote:
> I've been monitoring my
> local LUG and those folks are going to leave RH because of their new
> policies... but most seem to be interested in Gentoo with a few talking
> Debian

I find that slightly amusing. Red Hat is moving towards Debian-style
policies & some Red Hat users are moving to Debian to avoid those
policies.

> I don't know the reasons (I have not posted to ask... as it is none of my
> business) but I my guess is that Slack is not as well known as the
> others... even though it is older.

I think Rob hit the nail on the head with this one. Slackware only
really appeals to a small minority of people, which aren't usually the
sort of people who would use Red Hat.

> I get the feeling from meeting Deb folks
> and Gentoo folks that they are more proactive in "pushing" their distro.

I think it depends on who you talk to. I was convinced to try Debian
by a friend of mine who was quite vocal about Debian. When I was at
the LinuxExpo UK, there was only a small Debian stand at which they
weren't evangelising; they were merely doing what they liked & letting
people watch.

> Again, IF the community was interested in getting new Slack "victims" :-)
> some of you older/wiser/experienced guys/gals might wander into some of the
> other Linux groups (or RH groups) and tell the Slackware story.

I'd consider that trolling, personally.


--
Simon <simon@no-dns-yet.org.uk> **** GPG: F4A23C69
"We demand rigidly defined areas of doubt and uncertainty."
- Douglas Adams

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On Wed, 05 Nov 2003 03:26:47 GMT, Adams-Blake Co. thought it wise to say:

> I know it's not really an issue on this NG but IF there was an interest in
> attracting new users to Slack, this is a good time. I've been monitoring my
> local LUG and those folks are going to leave RH because of their new
> policies... but most seem to be interested in Gentoo with a few talking
> Debian

Most slackers - I would hazard a guess at - come to Slackware after
first becoming familiar with another distro after graduating from newbie
to novice, and realising they want 'more' from linux than that distro
provides. Or from newbies who first try Slackware then give it up for
something else a bit 'friendlier', returning to it in time when their
skills have been honed somewhat sharper.

Personally I don't think active recruitment will actually benefit
Slackware that much. It fills a linux niche as does RH, SUSE, Gentoo,
Mandrake and the rest of the distros occupying userland. If like
attracts like, then RH users will be more likely to feel comfortable
with SUSE than Slackware, since they are closer together than RH and
Slackware. This seems to be why a lot slackers also like - and run - the
BSD unices.

If you're a slacker on the inside, then eventually, you find your way to
Slackware. It's on enough sites like linuxiso.org and first stop linux
newbie info webrings, that an enquiring mind can find it.

I think it a good thing that Slackware is not one of the mainstream
commercial distros because then it doesn't need to cater to those kind
of users needs. If it did, it wouldn't stay the Slackware we all know
and love for very long.

> Oh, and how about Novell buying SuSE? (Or did they just by an interest? I
> didn't get the whole story this AM.)

Yeah, pretty interesting. You to have to wonder what this is going to
mean to the future direction of SUSE with respect to the end user. Are
they still going to produce personal releases or just focus on more
lucrative corporate/enterprise editions?

I wonder if this means producing linux for personal desktop use is not a
profitable business, and that's why these companies either sold up to big
companies whose business is corporate computing, or have now decided to
focus on markets in corporate computing?

The next 12 months is going to be pretty interesting in linuxland
to see what comes of all this maneuvaring.

A.

- --
KeyId 0x70CBA69C | Open PGP keyserver http://keyserver.stinkfoot.org
Andy McDowell - /etc + vim; the twin pillars of linux civilization.

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On Wed, 05 Nov 2003 03:49:16 +0000, Kurt wrote:

> If someone is leaving RH only because of it's policies, and not because
> they don't like the distro, I seriously doubt they would like Slackware.

True, ppl biten enough to care about things such as ethics, politics and
policies behind a distribution, is probably old enough to have discovered
his/her first and second choice distribution.

--
Erik L
erik@metalab.unc.edu
Sweden

Andy McDowell <andy@bhunta.take-this-out.net> wrote:
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> Hash: SHA1

pgp trash troll delete

> Most slackers - I would hazard a guess at - come to Slackware after
> first becoming familiar with another distro after graduating from newbie
> to novice, and realising they want 'more' from linux than that distro
> provides. Or from newbies who first try Slackware then give it up for
> something else a bit 'friendlier', returning to it in time when their
> skills have been honed somewhat sharper.

That's asinine. Most slackware users have always been slackware
users. And you can't get any 'more' from slackware than you can
get from any other linux. This party line you spout is just
elitist silliness.

> Personally I don't think active recruitment will actually benefit
> Slackware that much. It fills a linux niche as does RH, SUSE,
> Gentoo, Mandrake and the rest of the distros occupying userland.
> If like attracts like, then RH users will be more likely to feel
> comfortable with SUSE than Slackware, since they are closer
> together than RH and Slackware. This seems to be why a lot
> slackers also like - and run - the BSD unices.

Where on earth do you get these ridiculous generalizations? A lot
of slackware users _may_ run the BSDs because they are old time
unix folks (as opposed to unix wannabes like yourself) and
slackware was the only thing around.

> If you're a slacker on the inside, then eventually, you find your
> way to Slackware.

Sheesh. Cloying cliches. Watch much tv? "Slacker on the
inside..." We want to puke.

> It's on enough sites like linuxiso.org and first stop linux
> newbie info webrings, that an enquiring mind can find it.

> I think it a good thing that Slackware is not one of the
> mainstream commercial distros because then it doesn't need to
> cater to those kind of users needs.

What needs would those be? Reliability? Accessibility? Ability
to run linux software? Are slackware users "better" than the
users of other distros?

> If it did, it wouldn't stay the Slackware we all know and love
> for very long.

Slackware is an inanimate OS you idiot. Your world must be very
tiny indeed. What do you do, sit there and stare, drooling, at the
login prompt? You're an anal retentive, sir. The best thing you
can do for slackware is shut your mouth and stop embarrassing other
users.

Can't read any more.

cordially, even to imbeciles,

rm

"Adams-Blake Co." <atakeoutcanton@adams-blaketakeout.com> wrote in
news:X5_pb.156$Z25.124@newsread4.news.pas.earthlin k.net:

> Again, IF the community was interested in getting new Slack "victims"
> :-) some of you older/wiser/experienced guys/gals might wander into
> some of the other Linux groups (or RH groups) and tell the Slackware
> story.

That'd be akin to invasion.
Not even a cold flamewar.

--
"Say it in broken english" - M.Faithfull