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Joost Kremers <joostkremers@yahoo.com> is thought to have
typed the following text on 2003-12-01:

> Bartosz Oudekerk wrote:
>
> if i may add one thing:
>>> 5) monitor
>>
>> monitor
>
> we also use the word 'beeldscherm'. i couldn't say which of the two is more
> common, though. perhaps bartosz has an idea of that.
>
When I wrote that I was thinking of 'beeldscherm' also, but then
deceided that it's the equivalent of 'screen'. A subtle difference, but
still....

- --
Bartosz Oudekerk

Play Rogue, visit exotic locations, meet strange creatures
and kill them.
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On 1 Dec 2003 13:12:26 GMT, Joost Kremers <joostkremers@yahoo.com> wrote:
> german Maus is close to english mouse, but dutch 'muis' is a different
> sound.

Eerie. I was just about to correct that myself, actually, but I
thought I'd check the highly-scored post in the thread before posting
my correction.

> in fact, it's a diphthong that does not occur in any other language
> that i know of. which also means i can't really describe it...

From the sound of the letter combination 'ui' in other words (e.g
Duits), would it be something similar to how we would say 'oi'? I
don't think I could describe that accurately either.


--
Simon <simon@no-dns-yet.org.uk> **** GPG: F4A23C69
"We demand rigidly defined areas of doubt and uncertainty."
- Douglas Adams

Hallo Morgan

german:

> 1) Internet
Internet

> 2) server
Server

> 3) program
Programm

> 4) technology
Technologie

> 5) monitor
Bildschirm, Monitor

> 6) keyboard
Tastatur

> 7) mouse
Maus

> 8) compact disc (CD)
CD

> 9) digital video/versatile disc (DVD)
DVD

> 10) hard drive
Festplatte

Juergen

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On 2003-12-01, Simon <usenet@no-dns-yet.org.uk> wrote:
> On 1 Dec 2003 02:11:40 GMT, Morgan Landry <me@privacy.net> wrote:
>> Please state the following technological words in your foreign
>> language. Please romanize the spelling of them so I can notice
>> patterns between different languages,
>
> I don't know exactly what this project is about, but it might also be
> worth comparing pronunciation. For example, I think the Dutch 'muis'
> and German 'maus' would be pronounced in a similar way to how we would
> pronounce 'mouse' (I'm sure Joost or Bartosz will correct me, or add to
> that, if I'm wrong).
>
Interesting. The point of the project is to demonstrate how often
other languages adopt (or is that adapt?) English words for
technological purposes. You'd be surprised how often, for example, the
word "Internet" is used across languages, for example. Of course,
numerous exceptions exist. I wish I had gotten those Hebrew words in
time, just to show what a big difference non-Indo-European languages
make. I had to turn in the paper very early this morning. It was due
either last week or today, depending on if my teacher granted the
extension or not. She's very lenient on deadlines, and I've noticed
that the more lenient my teachers are on deadlines, the later I turn
in my homework.

At the end of my report, I had French, German,
Spanish, Italian, Dutch, and Czech, based on my efforts at Babelfish
and some people on the OT list. I also ended up changing a few of the
words, because, for example, "hard drive" didn't turn up anything
remotely useful on Babelfish. Nor did "server," because of the
ambiguity of the term. The new words are e-mail, computer, modem, and
software. But I realized that the word "computer" didn't carry over to
other languages, most likely because the computer wasn't invented in
the United States, IIRC.

Morgan

- --
Email me at morganlandry at linuxmail dot org.
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Morgan Landry wrote:

i'm sure you'd want me to give a shot at arabic:
> 1) Internet

internet (that's with a trilled 'r'...)

> 2) server

no idea myself. the dictionary mentions sirvir (a loan, obviously) and
'mulaqqim', which means something like 'feeder'. (the q is like a k but
further back in the throat. double q means the consonant is lengthened.)

> 3) program

barnaamaj (double aa indicates long vowel)

> 4) technology

tiknolojia; taqniyya

> 5) monitor

shaasha

> 6) keyboard

official: lawHat al-mafaatiiH (H indicates a very sharp h, made with a
constricted pharynx). don't know if there is a colloquial term.

> 7) mouse

(colloquial) maws (i.e. 'mouse'); (official) fa'r/faar

> 8) compact disc (CD)

(colloquial) seedee (that's a loan word, of course. 'ee' to be pronounced
as if it were english.)

the "official" term is 'qurs mudammaj', which is just a translation of
compact disk.

> 9) digital video/versatile disc (DVD)

no idea, but i imagine they'll say deeveedee (again with 'ee' as in
english.)

> 10) hard drive

"official" term is 'qurs sulb' (literally hard disk.) dunno if there is a
colloquial term.

the problem with arabic is that there are many different countries, and
computer terminology may vary from one to the other. another problem is
that there is an official written variety, and there are several language
academies in different countries that have programs to develop arabic
terminology for technological fields. and they don't always come up with
the same term... (so for example, there are at least four different words
for 'computer': Haasib, Hasuub, 'aql iliktroni (lit. "electronic brain"...)
and the loan word 'kambyutar').

all the terms i've given here are most common in egypt. other arabic
countries may use different terms, or the same ones, i can't say.

--
Joost Kremers joostkremers@yahoo.com
since when is vi an editor? a discussion on vi belongs in
comp.tools.unusable or something... ;-)

Simon wrote:
> From the sound of the letter combination 'ui' in other words (e.g
> Duits), would it be something similar to how we would say 'oi'? I
> don't think I could describe that accurately either.

well, *i* wouldn't describe dutch 'ui' with 'oi'... both vowels in 'ui' are
front rounded vowels, the first is a mid vowel (as it's called; i.e.,
slightly below the middle of the mouth), the second high. so its
pronunciation starts with a fairly wide open mouth, tip of the tongue bent
down, then the front of the tongue (which is *not* the tip, but the part
right behind the tip) is raised (same as with the dipththong 'ai' in
'raised', btw: it ends in the same way.) and all this with *rounded* lips.

it's really something you should hear... ;-)

--
Joost Kremers joostkremers@yahoo.com
since when is vi an editor? a discussion on vi belongs in
comp.tools.unusable or something... ;-)

Morgan Landry wrote:
> Interesting. The point of the project is to demonstrate how often
> other languages adopt (or is that adapt?) English words for
> technological purposes.

you have to keep in mind that there are different ways to adopt/adapt
english words into other languages. a language can simply borrow a word
from english, in which case its pronunciation will be adjusted to the new
language. but there is another possibility, namely that the word is
translated (a so-called 'calque'). most "official" arabic words are just
translations of their english counterpart. most dutch words are, too.

> software. But I realized that the word "computer" didn't carry over to
> other languages,

it didn't? some languages do use loan words (dutch & german 'computer', (do
germans spell it Komputer?) and arabic 'kambjutar', mexican spanish
computador/computadora) or calques (arabic 'Haasib' and 'Hasuub' literally
mean 'something that computes'.)

--
Joost Kremers joostkremers@yahoo.com
since when is vi an editor? a discussion on vi belongs in
comp.tools.unusable or something... ;-)

Bartosz Oudekerk wrote:
>>> monitor
>>
>> we also use the word 'beeldscherm'. i couldn't say which of the two is more
>> common, though. perhaps bartosz has an idea of that.
>>
> When I wrote that I was thinking of 'beeldscherm' also, but then
> deceided that it's the equivalent of 'screen'. A subtle difference, but
> still....

what is the difference to you? for me, the two words are synonyms AFAIK.

--
Joost Kremers joostkremers@yahoo.com
since when is vi an editor? a discussion on vi belongs in
comp.tools.unusable or something... ;-)

On 1 Dec 2003 14:04:10 GMT, Joost Kremers <joostkremers@yahoo.com> wrote:
> it didn't? some languages do use loan words (dutch & german 'computer', (do
> germans spell it Komputer?)

If memory serves, they spell it "(der) Computer".


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Simon <simon@no-dns-yet.org.uk> **** GPG: F4A23C69
"We demand rigidly defined areas of doubt and uncertainty."
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On 1 Dec 2003 14:05:44 GMT, Joost Kremers <joostkremers@yahoo.com> wrote:
[monitor & screen]
> what is the difference to you? for me, the two words are synonyms AFAIK.

To me, the 'screen' is the glass/plastic front, whereas 'monitor'
includes the plastic casing. The words are interchangeable, though, so
people mix them quite frequently.


--
Simon <simon@no-dns-yet.org.uk> **** GPG: F4A23C69
"We demand rigidly defined areas of doubt and uncertainty."
- Douglas Adams