Insane is as insane does, I'm telling you just that,

+Alan Hicks+ wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> In alt.os.linux.slackware, nalsing dared to utter,
>
>>I find that is just not true, Mozilla, though takes longer to start,
>>once up is far more usable than the overrated Firefox, the integrated
>>News and Mail modules are a joy to use.
>
>
> So you're telling me that Firefox + Thunderbird isn't faster than
> Mozilla doing those same tasks. I find that insane. I've done many
> tests (rather anecdotal but still) and ever time the smaller utilities
> with a more narrow scope combine to produce a better system than the
> bloat that is Mozilla.
>
> - --
> It is better to hear the rebuke of the wise,
> Than for a man to hear the song of fools.
> Ecclesiastes 7:5
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Jeffrey Froman <jeffrey@fro.man> schrieb:
> Mario Berger wrote:
>
> > Gnome's standard browser is Galeon. I've run it without Epiphany for
> > quite a while without problems.
> >
>
> Galeon was removed as well. Basically, neither will work securely at this
> point, because they have not been updated to compile against the most
> recent, and only secure version of Mozilla.

Galeon _can_ compile against Mozilla 1.7.3 (And Pat knows this):
lwn.net/Articles/103258/

I think it's a shame to drop support for it. I don't care about current
and future versions. But there is no Package for 10.0.

Of course one can compile it himself (I already did...). But dropping
support for a piece of software in a stable release in favour of another
piece of software that is not even in the development tree is bullshit.

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Trim your posts. Stop top-posting.
-The Management

- --
It is better to hear the rebuke of the wise,
Than for a man to hear the song of fools.
Ecclesiastes 7:5
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Kai Brust wrote:

> Jeffrey Froman <jeffrey@fro.man> schrieb:
>> Mario Berger wrote:
>>
>> > Gnome's standard browser is Galeon. I've run it without Epiphany for
>> > quite a while without problems.
>> >
>>
>> Galeon was removed as well. Basically, neither will work securely at
>> this point, because they have not been updated to compile against the
>> most recent, and only secure version of Mozilla.
>
> Galeon _can_ compile against Mozilla 1.7.3 (And Pat knows this):
> lwn.net/Articles/103258/
>
> I think it's a shame to drop support for it. I don't care about current
> and future versions. But there is no Package for 10.0.
>
> Of course one can compile it himself (I already did...). But dropping
> support for a piece of software in a stable release in favour of another
> piece of software that is not even in the development tree is bullshit.

I think what Pat was trying to say is that he wants to support only the
"best" of the Mozilla family, not all the entire family and all browsers
that compile against it. He's kept and is keeping Mozilla as far as I can
tell, so I say we just put up and use Mozilla, or we can uninstall Mozilla
and compile what we want.

I'm not sure of Slackare's intended audience at times, and have emailed Pat
once or twice asking questions. I wish somehow I could figure out what
Slackware's main ideas are, like if he's making a distribution for servers,
for hobbyists, to be Unix-like, for people with faster computers, for
people with slower computers, etc. They claim to be more Unix-like, which
is a good goal, and one that I think he's reached, but I'd like him to give
more input at times, or make the goals more clear.

He did say easy to use at one time was his goal, but Mandrake and other
distributions are usually thought of in this category before Slackware.
I'm not saying they are or are not, I'm just saying that I'm not sure as to
what he's referring.

--
BOFH Excuse #41: interrupt configuration error

nalsing wrote:

> I find that is just not true, Mozilla, though takes longer to start,
> once up is far more usable than the overrated Firefox,

Careful now, don't use "overrated" and such. Me, I use Mozilla, but I
installed Firefox on my wife's WinXP machine and she loved it. It was
fast. However, fast is a relative term. Someone used to a 166mhz machine
will think that their computer is fine, until they upgrade to a 1ghz
machine, then they'll look back and say their other machine was slow.
Speed is a relative thing only because it's actually more of a measure of
how long you wait rather than how fast you work. Most people only notice
speed problems when they're waiting, not when their machine is idle.

> the integrated
> News and Mail modules are a joy to use.

True, but I prefer KMail. Still, I can't stand Konqueror: too IE5 for me.

> That's the reason people use
> Mozilla, its still number one.

#1 in what? How many people use it? According to polls then, Windows is
still #1, by that logic. It should be about the user picking amongst the
candidates and deciding on the one they like. That's why I personally use
Slackware Linux and KMail and Mozilla: because I tried all other browsers,
and other distributions. #1 by who uses it isn't always accurate, as IE
has many major security issues (especially on systems not running WinXP),
etc, and doesn't comply to W3C standards. Bottom line: there's no #1
anything when it's up to user preference.

> Talking about using on a 56K dialup and PentII.

--
BOFH Excuse #8: static buildup

NOTE: This message was sent thru a mail2news gateway.
No effort was made to verify the identity of the sender.
--------------------------------------------------------

pgp trash troll delete

Hicks, Alan
188 Shady Dale Dr
Lizella, GA 31052
478-935-8132

+Alan Hicks+ <alan@lizella.network> wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> In alt.os.linux.slackware, nalsing dared to utter,
>> I find that is just not true, Mozilla, though takes longer to start,
>> once up is far more usable than the overrated Firefox, the integrated
>> News and Mail modules are a joy to use.
>
> So you're telling me that Firefox + Thunderbird isn't faster than
> Mozilla doing those same tasks. I find that insane. I've done many
> tests (rather anecdotal but still) and ever time the smaller utilities
> with a more narrow scope combine to produce a better system than the
> bloat that is Mozilla.
>
> - --
> It is better to hear the rebuke of the wise,
> Than for a man to hear the song of fools.
> Ecclesiastes 7:5
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux)
>
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> Rl8TpHlfrFlr0deV0AjQkEE=
> =mAfv
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

In alt.os.linux.slackware, NeoSadist dared to utter,
> I'm not sure of Slackare's intended audience at times

it's kind of odd. I don't think Slackware really has an intended
audience. I've always had the impression that Pat kind of does what he
likes and those people who like the same sort of things in their OS are
going to gravitate to Slackware.

> I wish somehow I could figure out what
> Slackware's main ideas are, like if he's making a distribution for servers,
> for hobbyists, to be Unix-like, for people with faster computers, for
> people with slower computers, etc.

Slackware's officially stated goals are (and have always been to my
knowledge) ease of use and stability.

> They claim to be more Unix-like, which
> is a good goal, and one that I think he's reached, but I'd like him to give
> more input at times, or make the goals more clear.

I think you will notice that if you start doing things in the Slackware
community, Pat will take notice and listen to you. If you think a
package should be included, you can always send him an e-mail and he
might think about it. If you send him patches or SlackBuild scripts,
he'll almost certainly consider it for some time before making a
decision.

> He did say easy to use at one time was his goal, but Mandrake and other
> distributions are usually thought of in this category before Slackware.

Depends on your definition of ease of use. If you mean something that
will configure everything for me and dump me into a completely useable
OS, but one that I might not know how to use well, then you're talking
Mandrake. If you're talking about something that is consistant,
requiring little relearning even between large version jumps, you're
thinking Slackware. Slackware is easier to use in the sense that
nothing is done behind your back so you (should) always know exactly
what is happening at any given time.

- --
It is better to hear the rebuke of the wise,
Than for a man to hear the song of fools.
Ecclesiastes 7:5
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+Alan Hicks+ <alan@lizella.netWORK> wrote:
>
>In alt.os.linux.slackware, nalsing dared to utter,
>> I find that is just not true, Mozilla, though takes longer to start,
>> once up is far more usable than the overrated Firefox, the integrated
>> News and Mail modules are a joy to use.
>
>So you're telling me that Firefox + Thunderbird isn't faster than
>Mozilla doing those same tasks. I find that insane. I've done many
>tests (rather anecdotal but still) and ever time the smaller utilities
>with a more narrow scope combine to produce a better system than the
>bloat that is Mozilla.
>

Bizarrely enough, that's my experience as well :-) I draged the latest
Firefox a couple of nights ago, installed it on my Slack 10, and
compared to Mozilla 1.7 (the Slack 10 one; haven't upgraded to the bug
fixed one (yet), Firefox was sluggish in both rendering an UI response,
which came as a bit of a suprise. I've dropped back to Moz now - Firefox
was that bad.

I odn't think my machine is /that/ slow really (2x Celeron 400), but
compared to what's available these days, it is :-)

Chris...

--
\ Chris Johnson \ NP: Platypus Records - 09. Union Jack - C
\ cej@nightwolf.org.uk \ actus
\ http://cej.nightwolf.org.uk/ \
\ http://redclaw.org.uk/ ~---------------------------------------

NOTE: This message was sent thru a mail2news gateway.
No effort was made to verify the identity of the sender.
--------------------------------------------------------

pgp trash troll delete

Hicks, Alan
188 Shady Dale Dr
Lizella, GA 31052
478-935-8132

+Alan Hicks+ <alan@lizella.network> wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> In alt.os.linux.slackware, NeoSadist dared to utter,
>> I'm not sure of Slackare's intended audience at times
>
> it's kind of odd. I don't think Slackware really has an intended
> audience. I've always had the impression that Pat kind of does what he
> likes and those people who like the same sort of things in their OS are
> going to gravitate to Slackware.
>
>> I wish somehow I could figure out what
>> Slackware's main ideas are, like if he's making a distribution for servers,
>> for hobbyists, to be Unix-like, for people with faster computers, for
>> people with slower computers, etc.
>
> Slackware's officially stated goals are (and have always been to my
> knowledge) ease of use and stability.
>
>> They claim to be more Unix-like, which
>> is a good goal, and one that I think he's reached, but I'd like him to give
>> more input at times, or make the goals more clear.
>
> I think you will notice that if you start doing things in the Slackware
> community, Pat will take notice and listen to you. If you think a
> package should be included, you can always send him an e-mail and he
> might think about it. If you send him patches or SlackBuild scripts,
> he'll almost certainly consider it for some time before making a
> decision.
>
>> He did say easy to use at one time was his goal, but Mandrake and other
>> distributions are usually thought of in this category before Slackware.
>
> Depends on your definition of ease of use. If you mean something that
> will configure everything for me and dump me into a completely useable
> OS, but one that I might not know how to use well, then you're talking
> Mandrake. If you're talking about something that is consistant,
> requiring little relearning even between large version jumps, you're
> thinking Slackware. Slackware is easier to use in the sense that
> nothing is done behind your back so you (should) always know exactly
> what is happening at any given time.
>
> - --
> It is better to hear the rebuke of the wise,
> Than for a man to hear the song of fools.
> Ecclesiastes 7:5
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux)
>
> iD8DBQFBVJHXlKR45I6cfKARAqnQAJ4wzFNCXfOFtyirfcv/6o3d23MjUQCfUcGA
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> =0DLP
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

NOTE: This message was sent thru a mail2news gateway.
No effort was made to verify the identity of the sender.
--------------------------------------------------------

pgp trash troll delete

Hicks, Alan
188 Shady Dale Dr
Lizella, GA 31052
478-935-8132

+Alan Hicks+ <alan@lizella.network> wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Trim your posts. Stop top-posting.
> -The Management
>
> - --
> It is better to hear the rebuke of the wise,
> Than for a man to hear the song of fools.
> Ecclesiastes 7:5
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.2.1 (GNU/Linux)
>
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